Can NASA even calculate if Apophis will hit Earth in 2029 or 2036?

[KelseyBryantAnthis]

This question goes deeper than orbital mechanics—it touches the very foundation of how modern science computes reality.

In LaurieWired’s video from August 12, 2025, we learn that subnormal arithmetic—a hidden corner of the IEEE 754 floating-point standard—can dramatically slow down CPUs and introduce subtle errors when dealing with extremely small numbers. These errors, while individually tiny, can compound over millions of calculations, especially in simulations involving gravitational forces and orbital trajectories.

But there’s a deeper issue: the value of π itself.
If our most fundamental constants are even slightly off, then every calculation built on them—whether in quantum physics, orbital prediction, or cosmology—carries that error forward. Many researchers argue that the commonly accepted approximation of pi (3.14159265...) is not the true value. One alternative proposal is:
\pi = \frac{4}{\sqrt{\phi}} \approx 3.144605511
This version is derived from the golden ratio (φ ≈ 1.618...), suggesting a more “natural” or geometrically balanced constant. It’s part of a broader theory called Circle_Cut_Pi, which estimates π by averaging the inner and outer perimeters of polygons inscribed and circumscribed around a circle.

Implications for astrophysics:
- Long-term orbital predictions (like Apophis) may be less reliable than assumed.
- Cosmological models could be skewed by foundational numerical inaccuracies.
- The limits of floating-point math challenge the assumption that digital simulations reflect physical reality with perfect fidelity.

NASA’s current models suggest Apophis will not impact Earth, but this video reminds us that our current computational certainty is not absolute. As we move toward more advanced simulations and AI-driven models, revisiting our mathematical foundations—especially constants like π—is essential.

Fading Audio is ROUGH on CPUs https://youtu.be/y-NOz94ZEOA

Would love to hear thoughts from others

[Hush]

Wondering how little time would lapse before the True Pi=3.1446 nonsense would be raised (LOL).

So if I may clarify yet again:

True Pi is NOT 3.1446 confirmed in Billy's Contact Reports but is also common knowledge among every mathematician, scientist and engineer in the World. We owe thanks to Christian Frehner, FIGU Core member, and Michael Horn, authorized American representative for Billy Meier contacts, for spreading the True Pi=3.1446 LIE to the FIGU Community and source for this confusion.

Christian Frehner, FIGU Core member, in 2017 published an article in FIGU Sign of the Times #77 where he presented his opinion as fact, claiming Harry Lear had discovered the True and Correct Pi = 3.1446. Then in 2019, 2-years later, Billy published Contact Report #722 and clarified True Pi remains UNKNOWN. If Billy clarifies TRUE Pi is UNKNOWN in 2019, it proves 2-years earlier Christian Frehner falsely stated True Pi=3.1446. The logic is simple, if True Pi is UNKNOWN (2019) then True Pi is NOT 3.1446 (2017).

The error in traditional Pi=3.14159 is incredibly small. In fact the error in traditional Pi=3.14159 is so incredibly tiny, it is completely imperceptible to Earth humans due to our primitive technology. The error in traditional Pi=3.14159 is so amazingly small that traditional Pi=3.14159 is still valid for all Earthly round and circular calculations in both math and physics as stated by Ptaah in CR 712. The error in traditional Pi=3.14159 is beyond our current knowledge.

Further anyone accredited in mathematics; or every mathematician, engineer and scientist in the world, knows and understands traditional Pi=3.14159 is the best estimate of True Pi common knowledge for centuries. The only reason the True Pi=3.1446 LIE gained momentum within the FIGU Community is because of the 3-rascals Christian Frehner, Michael Horn, both of whom are respected spokespersons of the FIGU Community, and Harry Lear, all of whom ignored Billy Meier's information and contributed to spreading the True Pi=3.1446 LIE and more about that here: https://hushdubwah.wixsite.com/figu-com ... challenges

Further more, in CR 251, Billy makes it perfectly clear Earth's future brilliant scientists, while trying to save our dying Sun, discover the error in Pi using an intrumentarium not yet invented. NOw Apophis is just around the corner, here is just a few years, well before Earth scientists will be trying to save our dying Sun and discover the error in Pi. So whether you or anyone else likes it or not, we Earthlings are stuck with traditional Pi=3.14159 when Apophis arrives, thankfully!

Pi=3.1446 is complete and total nonsense and it is unfortunate Christian Frehner and Michael Horn, spokespersons for the FIGU Community, started spreading this LIE and lack the moral integrity to admit their mistake and resolve the confusion they propagated, but prefer to remain silent, and have nothing to say for themselves and so the True Pi=3.1446 LIE persists within the FIGU Community.

[Arthur]

If our most fundamental constants are even slightly off, then every calculation built on them—whether in quantum physics, orbital prediction, or cosmology—carries that error forward

The difference is 0.1%.

Harry Lear wrote to Trump in 2018and NASA about this problem (Apophis)

Was the collision calculation performed with the corrected constant?

An Open Letter to President Trump : https://measuringpisquaringphi.com/corr ... -problems/

So we do not know whether NASA performed its calculations using the correct value for PI.

Recently i found that for mathematic formulas about trajectory, speed, gravity effect, relativity effect (special and general) on satellite for GPS the PI value in fact does not play a major role. Our planet is no a sphere and some constant approximations (The big Gravitational constant has different value for example) can easily offset the error of PI.

The consequence of the error in pi is in trigonometry also because of the radian (the computer unit for angle) who is calculated today from hard coded 3.1415926... value in countless of software programs.
It will be a disaster, a nightmare for the software industry, and a significant financial cost for IBM, Apple, Microsoft and others when they fix the error.

I put the explanation, proof about this error in PI in my substack :

https://arthur3144.substack.com/p/the-v ... roximation

The correct value is also found in the geometry of the great pyramid of Giza :

https://arthur3144.substack.com/p/geome ... pyramid-of

The FIGU official document about this error in PI :

https://theyflyblog.com/wp-content/uplo ... rehner.pdf

[Hush]

Hey there Arthur,

So we're going to start the Pi=3.1446 nonsense thread again huh, well so be it, Billy Meier's TRUTH must prevail, and Christian Frehner's, Michael Horn's and Harry Lear's LIE Pi=3.1446 must be squashed like a bug, just wish you and others promoting the Pi=3.1446 LIE would read and understand Billy Meier's Contact Reports references to Pi where Billy Meier makes perfectly clear True Pi=3.1446 is a LIE.

What I find interesting Arthur, your above post does not include one single reference to Billy Meier's Contact Report references to Pi, and why is that? I mean you've got links to your True Pi=3.1446 faked proof LIE, to Christian Frehner's LIE endorsing Harry Lear's True Pi=3.1446 LIE and also to Harry Lear's letter to President Trump falsely stating True Pi=3.1446, but not one single reference to Billy Meier's information about Pi so what's up with that huh? In your other posts addressing different topics in this forum you've properly referenced Billy Meier's information but when it comes to discussing Pi, oh you just conveniently ignore all references to Billy Meier's information about Pi, and promote your own biased agenda True Pi=3.1446. Isn't that interesting huh?

Well maybe to get to the TRUTH about Pi, we should actually review what Billy Meier has stated about Pi in his Contact Reports so lets us do a quick review since you seem to struggle with this. In Billy Meier's Contact Report #722 he states TRUE Pi is UNKNOWN which makes it PERFECTLY CLEAR Christian Frehner, Michael Horn and Harry Lear, all of whom had earlier claimed TRUE Pi = 3.1446, is nothing but a LIE.

Please read Billy Meier's Contact Report #251 where Billy Meier states True Pi is solved by Earth's brilliant scientists trying to save our dying Sun which will not happen anytime soon so we are stuck with traditional Pi=3.14159 which will remain VALID for the next oh, few centuries at least - thankfully!

Please read and try to understand Billy Meier's simple straightforward statements in CR #712, where Ptaah says 'Know-it-All's claim to know the True value Pi=3.1446 which is actually UNKNOWN (CR 722). Every "Know-it-all" lacks a formal education in mathematics, therefore with no accreditation fails to comprehend real mathematics theory and principles, and then develop fake Pi=3.1446 proofs using pretend math trickery which fools most people, including themselves but not the academics. This is precisely why the Know-it-Alls who claims True Pi=3.1446 have always been ignored for years by academia because Know-it-alls are not smart enough to understand why their True Pi=3.1446 math proofs claim is a fake.

There is no worldwide conspiracy to hide True Pi=3.1446, its just well known by academics Pi=3.1446 is physically impossible and a LIE, and that's the only reason why academia have completely ignored the Pi-Radicals claim True Pi=3.1446 because its total and complete nonsense. But all anyone has to do is read Billy Meier's Contact Reports #251, #712 & #722 to truthfully understand True Pi=3.1446 is a LIE.

Anyone who claims True Pi=3.1446 is typically uneducated, naive and gullible and foolishly believes they've discovered some fancy math that no other scientist, mathematician or engineer in the world can understand which is quite ridiculous. The error in traditional Pi=3.14159 is extremely small, so small in fact that its currently imperceptible due to Earth humans limited technology. That is, nobody at this time on Earth knows what the error in Pi is. We do know from CR #712 that the error in Traditional Pi=3.14159 is extremely small, because Ptaah tells us that traditional Pi=3.14159 may be used for all round and circular calculations in both math and physics.

Its important to stop spreading the True Pi=3.1446 LIE among the FIGU Community because not only is it a LIE, not only does claiming True Pi=3.1446 contradict Billy Meier's Contact Reports, but its also makes anyone who claims True Pi=3.1446 look like an idiot, buffoon, and uneducated moron when presenting this True Pi=3.1446 nonsense to academia. We can thank Christian Frehner, Michael Horn and Harry Lear for promoting and spreading the True Pi=3.1446 LIE within the FIGU Community and folks need to come to their senses and realize this was all a LIE foolishly perpetrated by trusted FIGU spokespersons Christian Frehner and Michael Horn as documented here https://hushdubwah.wixsite.com/figu-com ... challenges.

You included a link to Harry Lear's letter to president Trump, but are you aware his letter is filled with LIES misquoting Billy Meier's Contact Reports information? Harry Lear actually has 4 Bold-Faced LIES in his letter to President Trump, where he falsely claims Billy Meier endorsed his True Pi=3.1446 LIE, which you can read about from my above link.

[KelseyBryantAnthis]

Thanks for sharing such detailed and passionate breakdowns Arthur and Hush. I’ll start by saying: I’m not a mathematician—though a part of me certainly wishes I had pursued that path. The topic of Pi, especially in relation to its implications for physics, cosmology, and computational modeling, is something I genuinely enjoy discussing, even if only from my limited vantage point.

After quite a bit of digging into what NASA has been doing to mitigate computational errors, I found the following: On the computational side, while IEEE 754 floating-point arithmetic has long posed challenges for precision—especially in orbital mechanics and physics simulations—humans have developed robust tools to address these limitations. Languages like Java offer BigDecimal for arbitrary-precision arithmetic, and NASA has implemented formal methods to rigorously analyze and correct floating-point errors. Notably, NASA’s PRECiSA tool performs static analysis to estimate and bound round-off errors, using symbolic error expressions and formal verification via the PVS theorem prover. These tools help ensure that critical systems—like those used in air traffic control and orbital prediction—remain accurate despite the limitations of floating-point representation.

From Contact Report 251 (Billy Meier, 1995): “Only now is it really recognised correctly that the sun is a dying star and thus the collapse of the Sol-system is already determined, even if the sun will continue to exist still approximately 4.1 billion … years. So the scientists begin to perform at their best – and find the miscalculations underlying the pi number. By correcting and now correctly calculating the pi number, the scientists and the incredibly sophisticated technology will be able to harness unimaginable energies for the Earth…” (English translation). What this indicates is that the discovery of the true π will only come at a point in time when humanity is also openly acknowledging that the Sun is a dying star. Since this recognition is still far in the future, it follows that the real value of π has not yet been discovered or applied. Regarding the claim that True Pi equals 3.1446, my research into the FIGU materials—particularly Contact Report 251, Contact Report 712 from 2018, and Contact Report 722 from 2019—suggests that this value is inaccurate. While it was previously promoted, most notably in FIGU Sign of the Times #77 from 2017, it now appears that this was simply an error. I don’t believe it was any form of intentional deception, but rather a mistake carried forward in good faith. Once published, the documents circulated and were referenced without correction, which is understandable.

While Arthur presents a compelling geometric derivation of π as \frac{4}{\sqrt{\phi}} \approx 3.1446, it's important to note that according to Billy Meier and the Plejaren, the true value of pi used in advanced cosmic calculations has not been publicly disclosed. They’ve stated that Earth scientists use an incorrect value, but they’ve deliberately withheld the precise correction, leaving it to us to discover.
So while 3.1446 may be close—and perhaps encoded in ancient structures like the Great Pyramid—there must be a minute mathematical error somewhere, most likely stemming from imprecise data or symbolic interpretation. The Plejaren’s silence suggests that even small deviations could have significant consequences in high-precision applications like asteroid trajectory modeling or hyperdimensional physics amongst many other technical advancements.

I don’t think Christian Frehner or Michael Horn would deliberately mislead the FIGU community. From what I’ve seen of them in the past, they didn’t strike me as people who would knowingly spread misinformation. If they were mistaken or unaware of the full context, I’d like to think they’d be open to admitting it. It’s possible that by 2019, they had quietly revised their views without issuing a formal correction—or perhaps they did, and it’s simply not widely known or easily accessible.

It’s been a long time since I’ve seen either of them directly, so I can’t speak to how their views may have evolved. But I do have my doubts that they’ve somehow lost their integrity. I also recall seeing some calculations in one of Guido Moosbrugger’s books that touched on Pi or related constants. I don’t own Guido’s books myself, and since he has sadly passed, I often wonder whether he made any further progress toward uncovering the real answer. And I do wonder what the real answer is—what True Pi actually is—and how we might use it in the future to create a higher quality of life, whether through more precise technology, deeper understanding of nature, or even advancements in energy and consciousness, seeing as the spirit-form is a form of electron energy.

What’s been lingering in my mind lately is the convergence of two timelines: the predicted departure of the Plejaren in 2029, and the close approach of Apophis in that same year. I sometimes wonder—perhaps irrationally—if there’s more significance to that overlap than we currently understand. Will Apophis strike? I don’t claim to know, but it’s a question I keep returning to. I find myself wondering whether our understanding of constants like Pi, or the limitations of floating-point arithmetic, could subtly influence orbital predictions—especially as we approach such a rare and close encounter. And with the Plejaren reportedly leaving Earth in the same year, I can’t help but ask: is there a deeper connection, or is it just coincidence?

[C.B.]

A couple of ys ago I did a derivation of the exact π value, obtaining the value 3.1446.
I didn’t use any value related to the Golden Mean to obtain that result. In fact , I equaled only the perimeter of a circle with that of a square: 4b = π.

Have a look if you’re curious:

viewtopic.php?t=13

[Hush]

Hey there C.B.,

As someone accredited in mathematics with a degree in science, your True Pi=3.1446 proof is a FAKE and a LIE that relies upon pretend math trickery as does every single Pi=3.1446 ever presented. This is why Billy Meier in CR #722, states the True Value of Pi is UNKNOWN. Its unfortunate both you and Arthur lack accreditation in mathematics which renders you unable to understand the flaws in your pretend math logic.

[Hush]

Hello Kelsey,

You are the FIRST to ever post agreement True Pi=3.1446 is a LIE which only requires reading and understanding Billy Meier's Contact Reports. It also helps having a degree in science, which gives me the foundation to understand why Pi=3.1446 is physically impossible. What's so cool is that everything Billy Meier has written in the Contact Reports about Pi, agrees with conventional science and its the "Know-it-All"s like Christian Frehner, Michael Horn, Arthur, C.B., and others ad nauseam, who persist in pushing their True Pi=3.1446 personal agenda.

I don't agree with the proposed naive innocence of both Christian Frehner and Michael Horn spreading the True Pi=3.1446 LIE. As spokespersons for the FIGU Community, as soon as they realized their mistake, by misinforming the FIGU Community of their True Pi=3.1446 LIE nonsense, the morally, ethical, conscientious, principled, righteous response is to admit their wrongfulness, tell the TRUTH - immediately, and this simple act would quell further discussion regarding the True Pi Value, yet both Christian Frehner and Michael Horn remain silent which is totally irresponsible.

I too share the same 2029 insight regarding the two coincidence you've noted, but there is still another 3rd, 2029 cryptic reference related to Billy Meier's Contact Reports, and should all 3 prove credible will make 2029 a year of reckoning here on Earth, which gives me the heebie-jeebies.

[KelseyBryantAnthis]

Thanks for your replies, Arthur, C.B., and Hush — and I appreciate the clarity and conviction each of you brings to this discussion. I agree with the core point: the claim that True Pi equals 3.1446 is not supported by Billy Meier’s Contact Reports. In fact, CR 722 explicitly states that the true value of Pi remains unknown. That alone should be enough to pause any definitive assertions.
As for the 3.1446 figure, it’s often derived from expressions like 4 divided by the square root of the golden ratio (φ), which gives approximately 3.1446:
• φ (phi) is about 1.618 — a number that appears frequently in nature and geometry.
• √φ is about 1.272.
• 4 ÷ √φ ≈ 3.1446.
It’s a clever numerical approximation, and many truth-seekers have speculated that it might be encoded in ancient structures like the Great Pyramid — perhaps through symbolic geometry or proportional design. But clever doesn’t mean correct. The value 3.1446 isn’t derived from first principles, nor does it reflect the transcendental nature of π as defined in mathematics. Supercomputers have calculated trillions of digits of Pi, and 3.1446 is for now a symbolic curiosity — not a substitute for the real Pi, and again, what we currently accept as Pi is itself is not correct.
That said, errors like this can be valuable. They spark discussion, challenge assumptions, and sometimes lead to deeper insights. If someone promoted 3.1446 in good faith — based on partial understanding or symbolic interpretation — then the responsible path forward is to acknowledge the mistake and refine the conversation. At least when it comes to Pi. Honestly, I’m not sure where 3.1446 could be practically applied, in technology or design or if anywhere — but nothing surprises me these days. Still, that’s how progress happens: through correction, not condemnation.
I don’t know whether Christian Frehner, Harry Lear, or Michael Horn ever formally addressed the issue, but I’d like to think they’d be open to doing so. Silence doesn’t always mean avoidance — sometimes it’s just the result of limited bandwidth or shifting priorities. Either way, the teaching itself encourages us to seek truth, not to cling to error. So, it’s worth encouraging people to keep pursuing the truth, wherever it may lead.
And yes — the convergence of Apophis, the Plejaren departure, and other cryptic references to 2029 is something I continue to reflect on. It feels like it will be a threshold moment. If there’s a third reference you’re alluding to, I’d be genuinely interested to hear more.
In the meantime, I’ll keep studying, keep questioning, and keep trying to learn from every misstep — mine or anyone else’s. That’s the essence of the teaching, and the only way we move forward.

[Arthur]

Concerning the pi error, please everyone read the official FIGU doc about this.

Billy said there is an error in the pi number.
He never talk about his value.
His friend Guido yes.(3.144605 with the Giza Pyramid dimension)
The Plejarens have never mentioned the true value of pi in any contact. Like many other numbers, they are waiting for us to discover them for ourselves.
It was when Harry Lear traveled to Switzerland with his data, gave it to Christian Frehner, who passed it on to Billy, who passed it on to the Plejarens, and they told Billy, who was stunned (according to Christian Frehner), that the calculation was correct.

If some people have problem with that, please contact FIGU with their document as reference.
As for what Harry Lear did in his measurements, and if that poses a problem for some people, please do it yourself. (His value was subsequently reproduced.) Other people found this value , Panagiotis Stefanides in 1998.

I know this is a very sensitive subject for many people, who cannot accept the truth. Constantly denying, insulting, splitting hair, going personal, and becoming hysterical about it will not change anything. It's like beating a dead horse.